Do you need an instructional design degree to be an instructional designer? It’s a fantastic question since most of us accidentally fell into the ID field. So, how do you know if a degree is right for you and your career? To help with your decision, I brought in two experts in the ID field to share their perspectives. The first you are going to hear from is Tim Slade, the founder of eLearning Designer’s Academy and the author of the wildly popular The eLearning Designer's Handbook. You’ll hear from Tim about his ID journey, his thoughts around degrees, and what employers are looking for in an instructional designer. He also talks about strategies for aspiring instructional designers on how to maneuver around the degree qualification topic.
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Transcript:
SPEAKERS
Tim Slade, Luke Hobson
Luke Hobson 00:00
Today's episode is brought to you by instructional design Institute. If you're looking to learn more about the instructional design field and how to make your courses even better, this is the resource for you. Within the institute there are courses designed to teach you new skills right away along with support from a community to nerd out with. You also receive coaching from me on anything instructional design related. You can learn more by googling instructional design Institute or go to Drlukehobson.com. Sign up today for your free trial and now to the show. Hey, folks, and welcome on into another episode of the podcast. My name is Dr. Luke Hobson. I'm an instructional designer at MIT, a blogger, a podcaster. YouTuber, and the founder of instructional design Institute. My purpose is to help you make the online learning experience more meaningful for you and for your students. And you can find all my information over at Dr.lukehobson.com. The instructional design community has been talking about one question for the last year or so. Do you need an instructional design degree? To be an instructional designer? It's a fantastic question since most of us accidentally fell into the ID field. To quote the guest coming on the show today. No one ever grows up wanting to become an instructional designer. So how do you know if a degree is right for you and for your career? The thing is that it's a rather complicated answer. And it all depends upon the person, the ultimate goal, their prior experience and more. But I want you to hear from two expert opinions on the matter with one coming from a stance. But a degree isn't necessary and one coming from the stance, but a degree is recommended. Now once again, there isn't a simple answer to this question. And both guests actually acknowledge this in their episodes. It's why I want you to hear from two people I deeply respect in our field, and then you can make the right decision for you. These two experts are Tim Slade, the founder of elearning, designers Academy, and the author of the wildly popular the E learning designers handbook. And Dr. Karl Kapp, professor at Bloomsburg University, co founder of enterprise game stack, and the author of several books in instructional design, and learning. So this is a two part episode to hear both perspectives, with the second half being released later on this month. On today's episode though, we'll hear from Tim about his ID journey, his thoughts around degrees and what employers are looking for in an instructional designer. He also talks about strategies for aspiring instructional designers on how to maneuver around the degree qualification topic. It's a really interesting idea that he had, and I love it. He talked about it on this episode, in this episode is full of real examples and life lessons that I can't wait for you to listen to. So let's get this episode started. Here's the one and only Tim Slade. Tim, welcome to the podcast.
Tim Slade 03:14
Hey, thanks for having me.
Luke Hobson 03:15
Absolutely. I've been looking for this all day, as I was telling you before recording, I cannot wait to nerd out with you and talk about this entire topic about degrees, which is something that we constantly keep on hearing about on LinkedIn, Twitter, and Facebook and everything else. So cannot wait to dive into all of that with you today. But before I get ahead of myself, Tim, for the folks at home, can you just please introduce yourself? Tell us a little bit more about who you are and what it is that you do?
Tim Slade 03:42
Yeah, well, I'm Tim Slade, I've been working as a elearning designer and an instructional designer for a little over 10 years now. And before I started my own business, and before I started the E learning designers, Academy, and community, I worked in several different corporate organizations doing learning and development and then eventually moved into freelancing. Doing customer learning development and so when I'm not helping my clients develop amazing elearning and mentoring and helping others do that for themselves.
Luke Hobson 04:14
Absolutely, and you are everywhere. Literally, anytime I go online, it says all of a sudden there is Tim giving a speech. She's at a conference. He's making a new YouTube video like you are everywhere right now. So I don't know how you're doing it. But I'm tired. I feel like I'm doing this through coffee. Yeah, and willpower but yeah, you're you're doing an absolute amazing job with everything you know, for sure. Yeah, pass off to you. So where I want to start in with this entire conversation is just around instructional design in general because our field is booming like never before. And I remember I watched one of your your videos on YouTube and you actually set a line that really stuck with me and you talked about how you No one ever dreamed of becoming an instructional designer or going into elearning for a living, that was never a goal. How did you become an instructional designer in the first place?
Tim Slade 05:10
Yeah. So I think for, like a lot of folks, I fell into it by accident. So I, I don't have a background in elearning, or instructional design or education or adult learning theory. I, I have a degree in criminal justice. And I spent a huge portion of my career working in retail loss prevention, catching shoplifters. And then one day, my boss said, hey, you're really good at catching shoplifters. There's a training coordinator position at the corporate office on the loss prevention team to train others on how to catch shoplifters. And so I took the job thinking is going to advance my loss prevention career. And that's when I got exposed to elearning and instructional design. And it was through that process, I realized, I kind of tapped into a talent that I didn't know was there. And I fell in love with it. And the rest is kind of history. So yeah, totally by accident,
Luke Hobson 06:07
which is pretty much the sentimental, like every instructional designer I know of everyone
Tim Slade 06:12
you know, and the crazy thing is, nobody knows that when you're, you know, you feel that's where I think a lot of people in our industry struggle from imposter syndrome. Because nobody, you know, nobody realizes that everyone else fell into it by accident. And that if you do have a degree in instructional design, or adult learning theory, or any of that you're actually in the minority. Most people don't have a background in this the stuff that we do.
Luke Hobson 06:35
No, no, no, then the only reason why I knew about this field is because I worked at a university as an academic advisor, and I met instructional designers. And when I first heard about their title, I was like, What do you do? You get paid to do what? And then when I got to hear more about it, I was like, wow, that's, that's really cool. Like, you're actually designing this entire piece of knowledge for somebody from the entire process from start to finish, which is something that, did you ever take online courses growing up?
Tim Slade 07:04
Yeah, you know, it's interesting, I oftentimes Think about that. And I have a hard time remembering what my perception was of things like elearning. And or training before I got into it. And I guess it never occurred to me that there was somebody somewhere in the backend creating that content,
Luke Hobson 07:21
right, like someone has to be making it.
Tim Slade 07:23
And so when I like you, when I found out that there was a job in this, I thought, oh, there's, this is a job that people do, how cool is that? And so, it's interesting now when, like, when I go get a haircut, you know, and they always, well, when I used to get haircuts, because I haven't gotten a haircut. I've cut my own hair in the last year. But when you used to go to places to get haircuts, the question I always hate answering, when I'm getting haircuts, they go, Oh, what do you do for a living? And I've always struggled with answering that, because I don't know how to describe it. Because if you say elearning, or instructional design, they look at you weird. And so now what I say is I say, you say you know, when you start your job, you started your job here, and you had to sit behind a computer and watch like 30 minutes. So, you know, not touching your coworkers and appropriately, I create that. And then that was gonna be a really nasty look. Because that you know, then I'm the reason I'm the cause of their frustration having to sit through those courses. But then I tried to say, Well, I create the good ones. You just haven't. You just haven't experienced that yet.
Luke Hobson 08:25
Exactly. There. Yes. Good. elearning. Yeah, yeah, good, good. I was having a conversation with someone the other day and they asked me and I did say instructional design. And I was baffled when they're like, Oh, I know what that is. it I was like, you do like those the first times and then she actually said what it is I do ish now close enough is one could say without actually being an instructional designer. So so the field is changing, the world is changing clearly that now we're hearing some of those things, which has been very different. But that leads me into just going into seeing more about job postings for instructional design. And as we are seeing there are so many that are coming out constantly in every single job website. And they're really confusing. You look at one you look at another one, you're like, these really aren't similar, like how, how is this all coming into play? So in your opinion, why are job postings right now, but it's like, all over the place when it comes to qualifications for designers.
Tim Slade 09:26
Yeah, I think. I think one of the things that's been changing in our industry specifically in the way that organizations hire instructional designers, is that the the phrase or the title instructional designer means many different things to many different organizations. And there used to be a time back 10 or 15 years ago, that an instructional designer was a very specific thing you created content. And if you wanted to create an elearning course you have to pass it off to somebody who had expensive skills. And could code and develop, you know, any learning course. But nowadays, the tools that we use, like storyline or rise or Adobe Captivate whatever tool you might be using, you know, they've become so much easier and accessible for more and more people to be able to use. And so I think a lot of organizations have started to expand their expectation in terms of what it means to be an instructional designer. So yeah, you might be creating content. But now you're also going to be doing needs analysis, and project management and stakeholder management and E learning and E learning, development and graphic design. And if you're lucky, you're like the person who can fix the copying machine. And all of these things get lumped in to what is what these employers want. And the way I describe it is employers want t shaped employees, and it's t shaped is a really broad capability, but deep expertise as well. And that's very challenging for a lot of folks in our industry to be not just, you know, it's it's one thing to say you have to be good at it all. But even just being capable at it all is a big challenge for a lot of folks. And I think it's just organizations are expecting more and more from it, what it means to be an instructional designer.
Luke Hobson 11:17
Absolutely agree with literally everything you just said, one of the things that has really surprised me about my role and how it's kind of morphed into everything is because I'm the one who knows about the content better than anyone else. Because I've designed the course for the organization. Well, then when somebody is needed to give a webinar, or a presentation, or a demo or anything like that, like I have somehow become the demo guy, like I found myself because I like you have a microphone and you built the course want to talk about it? And it's like, Sure, sure. Not Not at all anywhere in my job description. But by all means, if you want me to, then
Tim Slade 11:53
yeah. I can't tell you how many times in my career, I was, you know, because I developed elearning, which is a, you know, my, it's my belief that e learning is a tool for Visual Communications and interactivity. People go well, if you can do that, well here helped me design my presentation, make this look pretty, or design this graphic. Like, there's all these peripheral skills that you that get lumped onto you because you do this one thing. I personally love that, because it gives a variety to what I do every day. But I know for a lot of people that's that's a struggle, especially those people who are those instructional design purists? Absolutely. Now, with all those trends, you were just talking about? Have you noticed them in one sector over another of either corporate, nonprofit government and higher ed, anything like that? Yeah, you know, I, my, when you talk about government and higher ed, that's kind of my blind spot. I don't know a lot. I mean, I worked in the government job for 13 months, and it was the worst 13 months of my life. So most of my backgrounds in corporate, and I think in general, not just with instructional design, but in general, with corporate jobs, you know, job descriptions are a formality. And so you were, however, that organization evolves and grows and raises the bar, you have to grow and raise the bar and adapt to it as well. But I think it's definitely true in the corporate environment, vironment more than more than anywhere else, as far as I can tell.
Luke Hobson 13:20
I mean, in higher ed, I can speak to that for sure. And it is mind boggling what I'm seeing for different postings. I had someone send me a job posting the other day, and they wanted a PhD in instructional design of a starting pay was 40k a year. I was like, yeah, that's not how that works. Where you can then go and find another instructional design higher ed job that doesn't need a PhD, just a Bachelor's is fine. And then they are obviously already pay more than that.
Tim Slade 13:46
I think, in the in the private sector in corporate America world. It's the opposite. They I don't think they're, you know, they might list that they want you to have a bachelor's degree or master's degree. But that's a formality. I don't think they really care any more about that. I've, you know, I have a degree in criminal justice. And that's never been. It's just never been an issue, that I don't have a formal background in education. I just don't think they care in private in the private sector. They're more interested in your skills, like what can you offer them right now? Whether you have 10 years or two years of experience or a PhD or, you know, a high school diploma?
Luke Hobson 14:20
Yeah, that makes total sense. So for instructional design degrees, I've seen a few of them. And I don't have one either I have a My background is actually I have a bachelor's in graphic design, marketing. And then I went eventually, and I got my doctorate in education, because I was like, I like higher education. I'm going to be here. Let's just go and do the thing. So So I did the thing. But when looking at specifically instructional design degrees, they vary. I'm seeing a wide variety of things. And I know that from listening to one of your videos, you talked about how for some of the degrees, they are certainly lacking specific skill sets that are obviously like practical applications, and how Things that you really would need. And just overall, in your opinion, when it comes to their curriculum, just like what what are they missing that really like that you really need to focus on improve on?
Tim Slade 15:10
Yeah, I mean, the the number one complaint I hear from people when they go and you know, there's first I guess we should preface it by saying if you're going back to school to get a degree in any of in learning, instructional design, Instructional Technology, you know, more power to you. I'm not saying you shouldn't do that. The problem because there's people who are really passionate about that are not afraid to parent trust me I've been I've they've blasted me on LinkedIn when I say you don't need a degree. But the biggest complaint I hear from people, when they go back to school, they spent all this money is and then they go try to find a job, especially in corporate America, that gets smacked in the face with realizing, oh, all that theory, I learned in my degree program only accounts for this much of my job. There's the stakeholder management in the project management, and the doing needs analysis and assessments, and just being able to create a beautiful elearning. I mean, all of those things, they don't teach you, you might get exposure to some of those tools, you might talk about it conceptually, but it's not, you know, a major part of the curriculum. And when I wrote my book, The E learning designers Handbook, that was the gap that I wanted to fill for people is that you can know the theory inside and out. But if you can't manage a project, or manage expectations of a stakeholder, you're gonna fall on your face really quickly in the private sector. And so, I think, a lot of degree programs, and this is, this is just based off of what I've seen that I have no real evidence for it. Besides my personal experience. I think a lot of degree programs have started realize this. And so the other day, like literally yesterday, I got this really amazing message from a PhD professor, I can't remember what university she was from. But they were using my book to teach their e learning instructional design program, which just blew my mind away. Oh, that's awesome. Yeah. And I had another program out of Toronto, they invited me to speak to talk about the practical nature of, of our jobs in the real world. So I think they realize that that's a gap for them. And they're trying to figure out the best way to fill that in a academic environment.
Luke Hobson 17:20
That's awesome to hear. I know that I've seen I've certainly seen thing. I've seen some of them where I'm like, okay, you're stepping up, okay, like, this is great. We're over times, like you're saying, there are courses on nine learning theories. And you're like, cool, that's a small part of what it is that we do. I mean, like, every time I go on LinkedIn or Facebook, I'll see a comment. They'll talk about like, Wait, how much is it of your job, you actually work with sneeze, like quite a bit, you know, it's a huge deal of how we're able to influence, negotiate, persuade those human skills that you don't learn about in school, but you need to know the essential part of what it is that we do. So I don't want to exclude the folks who they are passionate about education, they want to get a degree, they're, you know, their mind is set, that's what they are going to do. What should they be looking for, specifically, within a degree program that you would advise to say like, Okay, this would actually fit your needs?
Tim Slade 18:14
That's a good question. Um, you know, I guess my biggest thing would be Karen, north, I don't know if you know who she is, Cara North just did a post literally this morning, I think on LinkedIn, or Twitter, talking about what to look for in a degree program. And some of the things she mentioned that I really liked. And she has a background in academia, specifically on the instructional design side, and she talks a lot about making sure you go and look at reviews of that professor and reviews of the program. And, you know, maybe if you can find out what what kind of jobs, you know, graduates earned as a result of that, you know, kind of that stuff, but the big thing I think I would look for is, you know, anything that gets into the nitty gritty, practical nature of doing the job, you know, we talk about this all the time and instructional designs, we talk about not just knowing things about being able to do things for our learners, that's what we want to create training is to help our learners do things and their jobs. Same thing with a degree program, you want to hopefully graduate being able to do something with all that theory. So we'd be looking for, how is that program going to help you and support you in applying all that theory and that knowledge in a practical sense.
Luke Hobson 19:32
Now, what are your thoughts then on not full blown degrees, but like certificates, badges and smaller chunks of learning when you think about those?
Tim Slade 19:41
Yeah, you know, I go back and forth on this all the time. So I think it's great that you went and earned a certificate, or a badge or, or you went and did something. But at the end of the day, if it didn't help you be able to do something better. Then it's kind of worthless. And so I, you know, I wear that I used to in a previous job, I used to hire instructional designers and elearning developers, when I worked as a director of learning at GoDaddy. And, you know, I said this earlier, and I'll probably repeat it during our podcasts here. But, you know, in the corporate world, at least people want to hire for what you can do right now. So if you go say, take a certificate program on storyline, you better be able to use storyline after you complete that program. Otherwise, that badge really means nothing. And I know this isn't the topic of our podcast here today. But, you know, that's part of the reason why portfolios are becoming so much more prominent in the hiring process. Because anyone can say, on their resume that they can use storyline, it doesn't, it doesn't prove that you can do the things that you can say you can do. So they're great, that's fine. But at the end of the day, people still want to see evidence that you can do these things. So it has to be backed up with ability.
Luke Hobson 20:59
Even though it's not the topic of the conversation, portfolios are obviously huge. And you know, what, hey, let's just go into that then. So with the college degree, we're not going to go for that one, we're not going down that road. Instead, I want to focus, I want to make a portfolio, what is the best way to really showcase and to capitalize on my skill set, and to really demonstrate what I've learned in a portfolio?
Tim Slade 21:19
Yeah, you know, one of the things I've always strongly believed is that one of the one of the easiest ways that you can tell whether or not somebody is passionate about a thing that they do is whether or not they spend any amount of their free time doing that thing. If you go to work every day, and after you clock out, at the end of the day, you don't think about in this example, psycho elearning. If you don't think about it, if it's not bouncing around in your mind in any capacity, until the next day, then you're really, you really have to ask yourself how passionate you are about it. So the reason why I mentioned that is for me, the way I went about building my portfolio is I designed and built elearning. During my free time, I'd open up storyline and go Okay, today I'm gonna build a course on, you know, pick a topic, I literally on my portfolio, have a course on how to cook a turkey. And that's because I stayed home one year for Thanksgiving, and I was bored. And now it's a part of my portfolio. And so for me, the best way to build a portfolio is by, you know, creating, creating content and putting it out there. It's as simple as that, because I think a lot of people get hung up on, I need to get examples from my job or a client. The truth is, most of the work that you do for at work or for a client isn't portfolio worthy, because it's boring topics and clients and stakeholders have special way of ruining their, you know, your courses through their edits. So, I'm a big proponent of practicing your skill, you know, when during your nights and weekends, when you're when you when you have full creative freedom.
Luke Hobson 22:49
That's when you know, but you really found like your purpose and passion. Because when you were obsessed with that you can't shut it off. Yep. The first time I learned about how to do coarse mapping, and I had all these different stickies and whiteboard and I just had like, it was one of those types of scenes that must have been out of like, you know, a horror movie of like the police trying to like investigate like, title and together, because I had strings going to things and I'm moving around these different notes. And I was just like, Alright, Mike, how is this going to impact learning? If we do this piece here, this piece here? And I was I was like, Okay, I think I found a job I can hang out with for a while because this is just, I've never had that experience before. Like, I'm gonna get paid to do this. Yes, cool.
Tim Slade 23:30
Yeah, I think the people who are most passionate are the ones like to your point they obsess over improving their craft. And, you know, I've managed people who didn't obsess over it, and it reflected in their work, and it reflected in their job satisfaction. And, and it's, it's unfortunate, not only for me, as a manager to have to manage somebody like that. But it's also unfortunate that for them, because, you know, I want those people to figure out well, what is it that you're obsessed about, they'll do that. And you know, people find that at different stages in their lives. But that's, that's, that's super important.
Luke Hobson 24:05
Oh, of course, obviously impacts everything for the learning experience standpoint, too. If you're not this crazy, hyper proactive, like, I guarantee you, but the training the workshop, the course whatever it is you're designing, it's not going to be as good as you can make it right. You don't care as much, unfortunately, just you know the truth and that that should never happen, because that's what we do. We should be making awesome quality content. That's kind of the whole, you know, whole nature of things. So let's say that you are an inspiring instructional designer, and you are looking to apply for an ID position and it mentions about having a degree of a job posting. How do you get around this hurdle when it comes to different types of like resume filters, ATF systems and things of that nature to finally bypass the robot and to get your resume or your CV into the hands of a human being?
Tim Slade 24:56
Yeah, it's a it's definitely a game. They You have to play, you know, the hardest. I think the hardest part of any job seeking process is getting past the recruiter, once you're in the room with the hiring manager, you don't have to worry about the resume, you don't have to worry about the degree, because it's, it becomes really about making that person like you. And so for me, the first thing I always tell people, because I've been on the side of hiring is that if, if a if a job description says you need to have X amount of years of experience, or a degree, or whatever the case might be, just ignore it. If you look at the description, and you still feel like it's something you would be a good fit for, apply for it anyways, because most, most frequently, those requirements are just standard requirements that HR puts on them. And, you know, like I said, I have a degree in criminal justice, I have applied and been hired for countless jobs that wanted degrees in education. And it's because I've allowed my skills to compensate for that. So for me, you know, if you're really serious about, you know, landing a job, build a portfolio, put a link to that portfolio on your resume. And yes, of course, you know, there's those HTS systems that scan your resume, make sure you put in those those good keywords that align with that job description. You just got to get past that recruiter, once you're past the recruiter, you're golden. And as recruiters that's the other thing, I think people think recruiters recruiters don't have any idea. What it is that they're actually interviewing for. Recruiters don't know what instructional design is, they're just listening to make sure you sound like a competent person that might be a good fit within that company's culture. And you meet certain requirements, you know that you're saying the right things, and you sound like somebody that they might want to pass off to the hiring manager. So the recruiter, that recruiter part is just playing the game. Once you're past that, you know, then it's just making that hiring manager like you and creating a connection with them.
Luke Hobson 27:01
I love it. That's fantastic advice. Mm hmm. No, you nailed that one for sure. I was wondering, too, when I wrote that question to him, I was just like, what he's gonna say. Because sometimes I could predict, I'm like, Oh, you know, it's probably talking going down this path, or this one brow is like, but this is a tough one. Because I know that one person mentioned to me that like, he went into the funnel, LinkedIn learning course, on how to do this, how to get around it. And it was interesting. I was like, oh, okay, they're making LinkedIn courses now on how to get around this thing. But like, their entire point of their website is all about, of jobs, you know. So it's just like,
Tim Slade 27:36
I don't know, I wasn't, I was kind of strange. And here's, here's what I think I just told somebody this, the other week, who was asking me about, they were getting hung up on trying to draft the resume in such a way that it would appeal to the ATS system. And this person's resume was so edited, that she didn't recognize who it was describing anymore. And, and because you spend so much time trying to edit it to what they want it to say versus who you really are. And so here's, here's my bit of advice about that, is, if you're so obsessed about playing the game that you're editing a resume to, like I said to being describing somebody that you don't even recognize, well, then you're going to go into that job, trying to maintain in that interview, and potentially that job trying to maintain a facade that's not authentic, and you're probably going to fail. And so my, my advice is, yeah, there's a little bit of the game you have to play to get past the ATS system. But at the end of the day, you really need to be 100%. Authentic yourself. And if you get picked up and hired, then great you get to be you got hired because of you not because of this idea of a version of you that you created in your resume. And most hiring managers who know what they're doing when it comes to hiring and are really discerning and who they hire. They're not going through the ATS system, they're going through every resume to find the right person. And that I would rather work for that manager than the one who just hires the person who played the game the best. Does that make sense?
Luke Hobson 29:11
It makes complete sense. Every time you read about something where you're seeing an application, and it talks about something that's kind of negative, there's always a comment of like, Oh, well, you dodged a bullet there because you don't want to work for that organization. But you can already get this negative demeanor from the application itself. Like I've I saw one today but talks about how they were basically excluding teachers from
Tim Slade 29:35
literally just saw that today. Same thing. Yeah. That's horrible. But you don't want to be that person that you don't want to work for that organization. Anyways, they showed you who they were so great, you did dodged a bullet,
Luke Hobson 29:47
you know 100% you definitely do not want to work there. So that's good. So let's move away from the negativity was bringing the love I want to hear what is your favorite story when it comes to an instructional designer landing their dream job without a degree?
Tim Slade 30:02
Okay so I don't want to take credit for this.
30:12
But um, so when I, it's a personal story. So when I took over when I got hired at GoDaddy as their director of instructional design, it was it was actually it was an instructional design. But it was at first I got hired specifically for eLearning. And then it became all instructional design later on. But when I got hired there, I took over this, this small team of folks who were not elearning designers or instructional designers, by any means they used to be classroom trainers, then they got promoted into this. And my job was to turn them into real grown up instructional designers and elearning designers, and there was one individual on the team. His name was Matt, and he still works there. And I'm still friends with him. And he's fantastic. And he had never ever touched an elearning authoring tool before, or knew it's, you know, instructional design was, I knew what storyline was. And I gave him all these tools, you know, storyline and all these tools. And it just watching his his eyes light up and watching him blossom into this tapped in, tapped into this talent he never knew was there was so amazing. I mean, his first eLearning course. He built this really intricate branching scenario, and used all these amazing graphics. And we ended up taking it to dev learn a conference that's held by the learning guild every year in Vegas. And he presented it at demo Fest, which is like a science fair for eLearning courses. And he won an award and I mean, it was his first eLearning course. And so that, that made me so proud, because I think it, you know, it made me realize that, you know, we all of us in this industry, we have the power to help people blossom in ways that they never even realized they could see in themselves. And that's, that's, that's super humbling, and, and super powerful. And he's one of those people I remember. He would just like I described earlier, he would go home each night, and play with these tools, all these tools he had access to, and he would do all sorts of crazy things that we never asked him to do. And I remember one time, he showed that that we every every week, we would do or every month, we would do like a team demo of, you know, a show and tell of everything we've been working on. And he did this really cool thing with this Adobe Character Animator that used body tracking and all sorts of cool stuff. And I remember my boss at the time, he called a meeting with me after Matt had demoed this thing. And he blew me up saying, why is Matt spending all this time doing these things, we're never going to use this. This isn't a good use of his time. This isn't make good learning. And he should be spending his time elsewhere. And I told my boss at the time, I'm like, there is no way I'm going to tell this person to stop being passionate and exploring the boundaries of their capability and the tools. There are people on the team that I have to pull teeth to get them to open up this new tool that I gave them, why would I tell him to stop? He is doing exactly what he should be doing. So yeah, that's that that would be my story.
Luke Hobson 33:27
I love it. It's a real story. You know, I want people to hear that I want people to hear more real stories about how they do exist. This is like one of the ever days we had Christie Kittle Come on the podcast. And she was a former teacher who is now actually a supervisor for instructional designers. And it's like that, like those stories exist? Oh, yeah. People often don't share them. So we need to need to find them and make sure that people actually hear about these that they are real. We're not, we're not just making it up that you can just follow your dream. It's like no, you can. It takes a lot of hard work and dedication and a bit of craziness. But yeah, you can make things happen. Yeah, yeah, it sure does. It does. So where I love to leave everyone with is that I have been hearing more and more things about just folks trying to figure out like a direction of what they should do. Where should they learn more about things. And the thing is, is that you have like a million resources that people can check out. So tell the folks at home whether your book, your Academy, what can they do to just improve their instructional design skills from what you have?
Tim Slade 34:29
Yeah, I mean, of course, you know, I have my blog at elearning academy.io. That's my main website with my blog. There's the E learning designers Handbook, which is I have a second edition of that, which I released about six months ago that's on Amazon. That's a really practical guide to the elearning development process for new elearning designers. And then of course, the two the two newest things is the actual elearning designers Academy. It's an online course program that I that created to guide anyone looking to grow their elearning or instructional design careers, not just their skills, but also, you know, help them build their portfolios, learn how to use storyline, build portfolio examples. That's, again, e learning academy.io. And then I just literally the earlier this week, one of the things I've been working on is a community component to it. So I launched a community platform that's 100% free, anyone can join. And that's community.elearning academy.io.
Luke Hobson 35:32
Awesome. Well, I was gonna say where can people learn more about you, but that definitely covered? Is there anywhere else that people should go to learn more about you?
35:42
They can go to Timslade.com, which is my portfolio exists. I'm on YouTube, Twitter, LinkedIn, you just put in some slides, you'll find me. So
Luke Hobson 35:49
this this Google the man, he's everywhere. He's doing everything amazing stuff. Tim, once again, thank you so much for coming on the podcast. Yeah, thank you for having me. Well, folks, that was my awesome conversation with Tim, be sure to follow him on every channel and subscribe to his YouTube channel. I have only heard positive things about all of Tim's work. So check out elearning designers Academy and his book over on Amazon. And of course, you can find all the links to Tim's social media accounts, channels, the book everything else, they're all going to be down in the show notes below. If you are thinking about going down the instructional design degree road by the way, I released a new YouTube video on my advice on what to do before applying for a degree program. It's practical advice. I'm trying to find the right ID degree for you. So please watch this. If you are thinking about going back to school. Don't be like the people who find out later on in their instructional design degree program. But actually, you're not going to learn real life skills, the only cover theories and just you know those people unfortunately have wasted now time energy and 1000s of dollars on a degree that might not actually help them. So please watch that video if you're really considering and thinking about going down this path. As always, if you enjoyed today's episode, please give this podcast a five star rating. If you're listening on a podcast player, or if you are watching this on YouTube, be sure to like and comment and tell us what you liked about the episode. Every review every comments, every share of all this type of content. It really means a lot to me to the guests. And it's just so awesome to see. And we definitely check out everything. So thank you in advance for all that you do. To learn more about my instructional design content, you're going to head on over to Dr. Luke hobson.com. That's all I have for you today. Folks, stay nerdy out there. I'll talk to you next time.